FrenchOpen wrote on Aug 7^th, 2007, 3:53pm:


Thanks mate, I know you just want to push me into the 3rd installment on flying clamps because your machine has a racquet with only the mains in place and you are waiting to do the crosses since 2 weeks, OK, it's time to pick up where we left off.    

It's Thursday, time's up . . .

Method to String in 4 knots with 2 Stringway Flying Clamps :  
(1 x Double 9mm + 1 x Triple 18mm.)  (Part III)

One of the reasons that I string in 2 pieces is that I prefer to string the crosses from top to bottom. When I finish the mains at the bottom, when stringing with 1 piece then we have to string the crosses from B to T, unless of course we use the ATW or BOX method of stringing (which is an excellent solution, but a little more complicated).

In the example here I have chosen a standard 16 x 19 string pattern, with 6 grommet holes in the throat, so the mains finish at the bottom.

To start the crosses, we need to have 2 strings under tension so that they can be clamped with the double flying clamp. I always weave in the 2nd cross before the 1st cross string. It's habit but I don't have to pull as much string through the racquet just to get started. Once we have the 1st cross in place I will need about 6 inches more to tie the starting knot for the cross strings which will be anchored on the closest main string with a large grommet hole.

My preference is a simple knot which is the half hitch with a tail. It's nearly the same as Richard's knot, but I don't pass the string behind, but in front of the anchor main. If you use Richard's knot, please continue to do so, it's excellent.

I personally do not like the "classic starting knot" which is bulky and ugly, but for some stringers it's the only way to string, so if that's your case, fine, don't change habits.

What I suggest is that you can limit the risk of the knot being pulled into the grommet by leaving the second loop open (about half an inch) and only tighten this loop and the knot once the string has been tensioned and clamped.

So we have placed the 2 crosses in the top of the frame and the end of the 1st cross is knotted onto a main string in a big hole. Now I double pull these two crosses, applying the same tension as for the last 2 mains : 59lbs. This tension is 4lbs higher than the tension for the crosses, but it compensates the loss of tension caused by the double pull.

When the 2 strings are tensioned, the clamp is placed on the 2 strings close to the frame, on the same side as the knot. As these crosses are generally widely spaced, I use the triple clamp, the 2 center pieces will occupy the space between the 2 crosses and only the outer jaws are used to clamp these 2 strings. As I clamp only 2 strings instead of 3, I must tighten the knob almost a full turn to obtain the correct pressure on the 2 strings. Once the strings are clamped, I finish the knot by pulling on the tail and cutting it straight, but not too close to the knot.

Weave through the 3rd cross, and then the 4th cross, leaving enough string between the 3rd and 4th cross to tension the 3rd cross. Lower the tension from 59 to 55lbs, tension the 3rd cross and clamp the 2nd and 3rd cross with the double clamp. (if the 2nd and 3rd crosses are widely spaced, use the triple clamp to clamp the 2 strings, it can be removed from the first 2 strings once the 3rd cross is under tension.)

I weave in 1 cross in advance on the cross that will be tensioned next. It is much easier to weave the 4th cross when the 2nd is tight and the 3rd is slack, then the 5th when the 3rd is tight and the 4th is slack, etc, etc.

It is faster and easier to use both clamps for the crosses,  the triple clamp for the left side and the double clamp for the right side of the stringbed. After the first 2 (or 3) crosses, the triple clamp will need to be loosened about 1 turn on the knob so that it can clamp 3 strings instead of 2.

Alternatively, weave through a cross, tension the previous cross, clamp one side then move onto the next cross, tension then clamp the other side. Methodically, one cross after the other until you get to the 3rd last cross. Before you weave it into place, have a close look at the grommet to see where you are going to tie-off your last string. There are several possibilities, some of them are easy, some are not.

Generally Wilson racquets tie-off on a cross string, it can be on the 3rd last, or 4th last cross string. Babolat also but it's often the 2nd last cross. With Prince and Head racquets we often tie off on a main (but not always), so we must see where it is best to tie-off, and how to place the last cross as close as possible to the tie off grommet.

The easiest way is to weave in one cross after the other to get to the bottom, then look for the place to make the knot. If you are lucky there's a big grommet hole on the 7th main (the 6th is already occupied by the main string knot), and you can tie-off nicely.

If however, you need to tie-off on a cross string, if it's the 2nd last cross, that's fine, go for it, if it's further up the frame then there is a better way to do it, especially if you want to do it well. The further the knot is away from the last string clamped, the more tension you loose from the knot.

Here are 2 examples of how to finish the crosses :

1.) Tie-off on the 3rd last cross :
> weave in 3rd last cross, increase tension to 59lbs, tension and clamp 4th last + 3rd last cross.
> weave in last cross, then 2nd last cross, double pull with tension at 59lbs.
> clamp 2nd last + 3rd last cross, tie-off on 3rd last cross.
> cut the string neatly at a 90° angle, not too close to the knot.

or

1.) Tie-off on the 4th last cross :
> Skip the 3rd last cross, weave in last cross, then 2nd last cross, double pull with tension at 59lbs.
> clamp 2nd last + last cross, with the wide spaced triple clamp
> weave in 3rd last cross, tension at 59lbs,
> clamp (with either the double or the triple clamp) the 3rd last + 4th last cross, tie-off on 4th last cross.
> cut the string neatly at a 90° angle, not too close to the knot.

That's about it, if you have a string ranger (to straighten the strings) make it look as good and staight as possible, if the strings are curved or wavey then the string job looks bad and a pro player would get mad with you. Presentation is important.

If you really want it to look pro, put the racquet in an appropriate plastic bag, it really makes a big difference. Ask Jay, he swears by them.  

Cheers,
JayCee.

Note 1. The main strings on each side of the frame can block the access to the grommet holes for the last crosses, with good cutting pliers it is easier to cut the end of the string with a sharp angle, then to push this end with needle nosed pliers, just under the main and ease the string into the grommet. With good tools this operation is quite easy, without the appropriate tools, it can be considerable more difficult.

Note 2. : If you have the same 16 x 19 string pattern, but with 8 holes in the throat, the mains will finish at the top, in this case, it can be easier to put the two first cross strings in place, without tensioning them, before you tie off the knots for the mains. If not tie-off the mains as above, however in some racquets the groove where the strings lie in the head of the racquet (to protect the strings from abrasion in contact with the court) can be either deep or narrow (or both) and in this case getting those crosses in can be a real problem.  

Note 3. : With a Head Prestige Classic 600, where the grommets are closed, it is preferable to string either ATW, or finish each of the mains on a cross string. Both of these methods are used essentially by professional stringers, but are more complicated to explain and cannot be improvised.  

How can you remember to reset your tension so often? Especially if you have a stack of 25 frames and 8 hours to do it.

Chuck

vsgut1954 wrote on Aug 12^th, 2007, 9:43pm:

Chuck,

For a pro-stringer who needs to string 3 sticks/hour for a day, I would think that maybe he would be inclined to set the machine at 55lbs in the morning and leave it there all day. . .  

With a good electronic pro-machine, changing tensions doesn't take long and remembering to do it twice/stick is not that difficult . . .  

It's like everything else in stringing, once you have the habit it doesn't take any longer than stringing as usual, with an electronic machine you only change the tension 2 times :
 -  you can set the knot tension at +4lbs
 -  the initial setting for the mains is 55lbs > drop to 51lbs after stringing the 6 central mains,
 -  return to 55 lbs for the last 2 mains and the crosses
The +4lbs for the 3 knots (2 mains & last cross) are already set in the machine, so you just hit the button.

If you have a more constant SBS, then perhaps its worth the trouble to modify the tension a couple of times during the string job.

Now it's up to you.  
JC.

todot62 wrote on Aug 12^th, 2007, 10:21pm:

Tod,

It depends largely on what you want to achieve, but the use of the SW Flying Clamps is not the only reason to change the tensions during stringing, these clamps can be used by a pro-stringer in a professional environment, even with an electronic stringing machine.
They are an alternative to a fixed clamp system . . .

In the present case it is a home stringer who wants to obtain the best possible result and to be able to do it repeatedly on his own racquets. I have explained how to get the good tension stability in the stringbed, simply by minimizing the risk of tension loss in 3 very sensitive zones :

1.) The 6 central mains are of course the longest mains and should be strung up tighter than the others, if in addition to this you have one or both of the following factors :
-  you string with flying clamps : because of the double pull
-  you don't have direct access to the throat grommets.  Many machines, the SW for example, don't have a 360° turn table and you have an indirect pull in the throat, the string is deviated over (or under) the frame, friction through the grommet (string angle) and on the frame causes substantial loss of tension on L2 and R2 for 6 throat grommets (or L1/R1 and L3/R3 for 8 throat grommets). Even if you have fixed clamps, it is preferable to increase the tension by 4lbs for each of the 6 center mains.  

2.) The last main-strings at each side of the frame. The loss of tension between the last clamp and the knot is very high, (even with fixed clamps) especially with mono-filament and poly strings, which, due to their very low elongation, with flying clamp twist (or fixed clamp draw-back) plus some knot slip, a loss of 10lbs (or even much more) tension on the last main is probable. Check the tighness of the outside mains once you've finished the string job, it's probably quite slack, and this will lead to a loss of tension right across the stringbed. The premature drop of tension and a lower SBS is more often caused by the poor quality of the string job, rather than by the quality of the strings.

3.) The last crosses before tying off, exactly the same problem as in point #2. You need to add on some tension to compensate the inevitable loss after tying the knot.

So, these losses of tensions are only partly caused by the use of flying clamps. If the use of a SBS mesuring device, for example : the SW StringLab or the ERT.300, could be generalised then there would more awareness of the extent of the problem of loss of tension, being aware is fine, but then what do you do about it?

Either you choose to ignore this, because :
-   it's not always good for business if the strings hold their tension too well for too long.
 -  it's too complicated to change tensions 4 times when you string a racquet.
 -  you don't want to invest about $150 in a SBS device.

or, to the contrary you choose to buy a SBS mesuring device :
 -  with a StringLab or an ERT.300 (or similar), then you may well look for the reasons that the read-outs on SBS do not correspond to what you expected,
 -  some of the solutions may be found here on the GSS forum,
 -  you improve your stringing technics to obtain better results.

What in fact we are talking about :
 -  why change tensions during the string job?
 -  is it a waste of time?
 -  if it is preferable, how much more time will it take?

Take this example : same tension : 55lbs for both mains & crosses :
 -  for the 6 center mains : L1 L2 L3 & R1 R2 R3
 -  decreasing the tension to 51lbs : L4 L5 L6 & R4 R5 R6
 -  increasing by +8lbs to 59lbs : L8 L7 & R8 R7 (tie-off mains),
 -  keeping the same tension, 59lbs for the 2 initial cross strings,
 -  resetting the tension to 55lbs for the following crosses,
 -  increasing this tension +4lbs>59lbs for the last 2 crosses before tie-off.

The tension changed a total 4 times :
 -  how much longer does it really take to string the racquet?
 -  how much longer will the racquet play better? (that is the question)  

Let's wait and see how it works for your son's racquet.  

JC.

I will stick with fixed clamps.

Lindsey Davenport used to do Progressive string. I would not pretend to tell you how to do it except for changing tension as you string outwardly. Good Luck with your adventure.

Chuck

JayCee wrote on Jul 25^th, 2007, 12:10pm:


Tod,
As you are one of the very few stringers who have already acquired a Stringway Triple Clamp, this post is directed to you because you can try something different to finish off your mains. As you are well aware the main reason that this clamp was introduced was to minimize the twist, a serious cause of tension loss on the last main before the knot.

In my explanation of my method of stringing using the SW double + triple flying clamps, I recommend jumping from the 6th main to the 8th main then the 7th main with a double pull on the 7th and 8th (for a 16 main string racquet), then clamping the 5th+6th+7th main with the triple clamp, tie-off on the grommet of the 6th. (with a regular flying clamp, you would only clamp the 6th+7th main).

I have recently changed the clamping position for the SW triple clamp, now I am clamping the 6th+7th+8th mains, then tie-off of the 7th main on the grommet of the 6th. There is absolutely no draw-back on the 7th main. I have never seen such accuracy on the last main before tie-off, no matter what the machine nor the fixed clamping system. With the SW triple flying clamp used this way, the last main tensioned before the knot is just as tight as the mains on either side. Unbelievable.  

I have firmly believed since several years that SW flying clamps are more efficient than most fixed clamps, but there has always been the problem of loss of tension on the last main before the knot, due to clamp twisting.  With the SW triple flying clamp and my method, this problem has been illiminated because the clamp is maintained perfectly straight by the 2 strings, 1 at each side of the last main. There is no twist and no draw-back.  

Give it a try, I am certain that you will be just as impressed as I am.

JC.

todot62 wrote on Sep 17^th, 2007, 11:49pm:

Tod,
I was sure that you would be very pleased with the SW triple clamp used this way to finish the mains.  

For the crosses, as you have noted, the twist or draw-back is very limited because the clamp is maintained in line by both the mains and the crosses. The very wide space between the outer jaws when the 2 center pieces are clamped together allows you to clamp very close to the frame when the last 2 cross strings are widley spaced . . .
this is impossible with most other flying clamps.

It would be unlikely that you could clamp the last 3 crosses #18+19+20 because of this large space between the crosses 19 & 20.  

If however, you can place the SW triple clamp 1 cross higher up 17-18-19 for an 16x20, (or 16-17-18 for a 16x19) then it could be a good option, but you would need to jump the cross just below the anchor string for the knot (or just above if the tie off is on the 2nd last cross like the Babolat P.D.) then weave in the last 2 crosses do a double-pull, clamp (large), before finishing the remaining cross to tie off on the adjacent grommet on the anchor string.  

In this case no problem to position the last string in the center of the triple clamp. That would be "perfection guaranteed". Draw-back = 0.

Quote:


This is what "FrenchOpen" has opted for. In his tennis shop he has a Babolat Electronic Machine with 1 central fixed clamp, which he only uses to start and to finish the mains and crosses. He uses the SW flying clamps for all the other operations. He doesn't have a SW triple clamp yet, but it won't be long before he acquires one.

Thanks for your feed-back, we can all learn something from each other's experiences and the GSS Forum to talk about them.
Thanks Tim, what would we do without you ??  
Later,
JC.  

bigmatt wrote on Sep 18^th, 2007, 2:21pm:



I'll let JC answer for himself but having now used this method about 20 times I’ll give you my thoughts.

If you read the posts carefully you will see that JC's method does not call for an 8# increase over reference for the last two mains. It is a 4# increase; something that I was always trained to do on a tie-off when I was stringing on an Ektelon with fixed clamps anyway.  

(16x18)
M1, M2, M3 = reference
M4, M5, M6 = reference less 4#
M7, M8 = reference plus 4# (tie-off)

C1, C2 = reference plus 4# (tie-off, double pull)
C3-C16 = reference
C17, C18 = reference plus 4# (tie-off)

I see nothing out of the ordinary here other than DROPPING the tension 4# on M4-M6.  Since this thread I have strung both dropping the tension on M4-M6 and leaving them at reference.  I can tell you according to the Stringmeter it is more consistent across the mains to drop M4-M6 4#.

Now regarding the looping of M7, M8, this is no different than a ATW, or any other nontraditional stringing pattern.  I used to do it on crosses for Head LM racquets all the time to keep the head guard from flipping up on the edge.

I think when one looks at JC's in-depth description of his method it can appear to be MUCH more complicated than it is.  Once one actually applies the method it becomes quite apparent why one would choose to string this way.  The goal here is to have a very consistent stringbed and from my experience it has worked.  

Tod